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I’m busy with work for a while. I’ll give my thoughts on it later today. Just wanted to hear what other people thought.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3362701
11:33: My one thought for right now is I wish we didn’t give up both 3rd round picks.
April 23rd, 2008 at 11:53 am
without getting too detailed, I think it is too much to give up especially since we do not have a PROVEN playoff QB. Recent statistical analysis has closed the points gap that teams place on draft choices. When they make draft oriented trades, the points must match. Now, outside of the top ten, the point difference between 1st and 3rd round picks is relatively small. I’m a huge allen fan, just a little worried about the future especially with how thin we are on o-line and DB in the coming years.
April 23rd, 2008 at 11:58 am
Great Pick-up…we can’t draft for crap anyways; might as well pick up a guy we know can contribute. We need a tackle and a backup center (Tony Brinkhouse-Bloomington???) to replace Birk when he is done next year. So stoked about the Vikes; ps. picking up a QB in the draft is to risky; besides I would rather wait a couple of years and draft current gopher QB Webber…
April 23rd, 2008 at 12:12 pm
Randy Mosss=4th round pick
Shaun Rogers = 5th round pick
Steve Young=2nd and 4th
Brett Farve=1st round pick
Jared Allen=1st round, two 3rd rounds
Allen is a good player. But he is not worth those picks plus a 30 million guarenteed contract.
April 23rd, 2008 at 12:30 pm
As a devoted Packer fan, this trade scares me. Three pro bowl d-linemen more than cancels out an inept quarterback. Allen led the league in sacks last year. Lets say that kind of talent and skill eliminates one touchdown per game. Factor that in to last seasons final scores. With Allen, the Vikes could have been 13-3. Of course that may be a stretch, but defensive ends are game changing athletes, and the Vikes just got one of the best.
I am guessing this has changed the Packers strategy for the draft. They might be thinking linemen now.
April 23rd, 2008 at 1:36 pm
I understand that the Vikings were putting a priority on defensive linemen, but a 1st round and two 3rd round picks is crazy, especially with how spotty Minnesota was at QB last season. Maybe Brian Brohm will be available when it gets to the Vikes second round pick, but who knows. Good player? Definitely. Worth it? Maybe.
April 23rd, 2008 at 1:43 pm
This trade could work out to our benefit, but way more often than not, multiple high draft pick for one player deals dont work out.
especially since the vikings have drafted extremely well in the new regime and especially in the 2nd, 3rd and 4th rounds.
2nd round the last 2 years
sidney rice
cedric griffin
tarvaris jackson
ryan cook
3rd round
marcus mcCaulley
4th round
brian robison
ray edwards
April 23rd, 2008 at 2:02 pm
Do Vikings fans love to be negative about everything no matter what?
The Vikes were insanely weak at D-end last season so they go out and get one of the best D-ends in the league, and fans are whining about losing picks. You think a third round D-end is going to get you where you need to be this season?
April 23rd, 2008 at 2:10 pm
Chad, I am one of the most positive viking fans around, and loved the philosophy of obtaining extra draft picks. Why did we go away from this - to a “this year” philosophy. I think a fair reason is that we need a stadium passed either this session or next year, and without a strong playoff contender, zygi doesnt see it happening. So let’s go after it now and hope we aren’t mortgaging the future away.
I have always felt that a “this year” mentality gets you into a lot of trouble. That said, my contingent will roll out to green bay this september for some 6am tailgating and an epic beatdown of the packers.
Lastly, my favorite event of the year is the nfl draft. Now with the 1st pick already decided and the vikings with no 1st round pick, I am slightly depressed.
April 23rd, 2008 at 2:27 pm
Here’s my 2 Cents:
I’m no draft specialist, but how many teams would have traded a high draft pick, say high enough to draft gholston or long, for our 1st and 2 thirds. And quite frankly, I’d rather have one of them instead. However, I am excited about Allen, but we definately gave up too much.
I will say this…Acquiring depth this year will not bring us to the Super Bowl…only playmakers will…and we got one. On the other hand, we have no depth anywhere which doesn’t bode well for the future.
Oh, and those of you who think we need a quarterback don’t watch enough football. T-Jack isn’t a superstar but neither is Trent Dilfer and he won a superbowl behind an unreal defense. T-Jack is young. He managed our team well without any help at wide-out and he will improve.
April 23rd, 2008 at 2:34 pm
Jared Allen is only 26. I am not so sure it is a “this year” sort of situation. He is an immediate improvement that you will have for the next 5-7 years.
I too love the draft, but would definitly be happy if the Packers gave up their first rounder for someone like Allen.
One last thing, and I will shut up. With the draft, most of the time, you aren’t exactly sure what you are getting until maybe 2 or 3 years down the road. With Allen, you know what you got.
April 23rd, 2008 at 2:44 pm
let’s also remember that one more violation of the NFL personal conduct policy will net allen a 1 year suspension.
April 23rd, 2008 at 5:50 pm
We traded a first and two thirds!!!
Moss in his prime was traded for one first and a above average linebacker at the time.
Last year he was traded for one fourth round pick.
The cowboys just picked up Pacman for one fourth round pick.
Wes Welker was traded for a third round pick (I think…maybe second? But either way…)
SHIT…If I ran the Vikes the same way I ran my Madden squad, we’d win the superbowl every year because we would currently have all of the following players on our team:
Randy Moss
Daunte Culpepper
Pacman Jones
Chad Johnson
Brian Urlacher
Wes Welker
All in addition to our current team (Minus Berrian because clearly we wouldn’t need him).
April 23rd, 2008 at 10:21 pm
We gave up a lot, but I still like the deal. We haven’t had a DE presence since Doleman and have wasted so many draft picks trying to find one. Since 1995: Derrick Alexander (rd. 1), Duane Clemons (rd. 1), Stalin Colinet (rd. 3), Kailee Wong (rd. 2), Dimitrius Underwood (rd. 1), Talance Sawyer (rd. 6), Michael Boireau (rd. 2), Kenechi Udeze (rd. 1), Darrion Scott (rd. 3), Erasmus James (rd. 1), Ray Edwards (rd. 4), Brian Robison (rd. 4).
We likely wouldn’t have gotten a DE in round 1 unless we reached for Merling, and what are the chances that a rd. 2 or later DE is going to have an impact in the next few years?? We just picked up a DOMINANT DE who will wreak havoc on opposing QB’s for years to come. We don’t have cap problems and it’s not your money so why should you care? This was an EXCELLENT trade for both teams IMO.
To address some previous posters:
-I am not sold on T Jackson either but you have to admit he did look very good at points (Denver, Detroit, San Fran). I believe he will improve this year and will lead this team to a 10+ win season.
-I don’t think this is a “this year” type of move. He is 26 and approaching the prime of his career. He should be a cornerstone to our D-line for 6 years and that will save us, oh I dunno, 6 shitty DE draft picks.
-As far as the suspension, I read that in September his DWI’s will lose impact because they are 2 years old. Therefore, another violation would likely be a few game suspension and not an entire season.
Superbowl, Homeboy?
April 24th, 2008 at 2:50 am
I’m not even a Vikes fan. I just think it’s odd for a team to invest so much in one player when there are still other holes that need to be filled.
April 24th, 2008 at 12:19 pm
paul - most of your comments are completely unfounded…it has been reported by many media outlets that this is in fact part of a “this” year approach to secure stadium funding.
Also, goodell’s reinstatement of allen after 2 games of a 4 games suspension came with the understanding that if this happens again - ever, it’s a one year suspension. And let’s not forget about the expiring CBA next year, It is suspected the new one will give goodell even greater suspension powers.
lastly, who cares about the players drafted by a previous regime, studwell has done a great job with the draft the past few years.
April 24th, 2008 at 12:29 pm
To the point that 3 great D-Linemen outweigh an inept quarterback:
I think that the Vikings proved last year that no matter how great a team is at achieving the merits of the typical trite saying of “stop the run and run the football,” things can go wrong no matter what if you have a T-Jack type in the backfield.
That being said, I think that this trade dramatically improves the Vikings, especially given their recent lack of success in obtaining talent through the draft. As a devout Packer fan, that D-Line terrifies me. However, I still have a warm, fuzzy feeling when I realize that T-Jack is still the Vikes’ QB, with limited resources at WR (Berrian is a good 2, not a 1, though Sidney Rice is and will continue improving).
This trade cannot be compared to a Favre/Moss situation. The Favre trade from ATL was unique in that Favre had 3 or 4 pass attempts total before the trade, all of them incomplete and most of them INTs. Moss was extremely successful in MIN, but stopped trying in OAK, so there was a level of risk associated with the trade.
Allen is a proven DE who has made big plays on a consistent basis. The only risk associated with the trade for the Vikings from a personnel standpoint is his off the field problems (3 DUIs in 4 years).
To the person who said they’d rather have Gholston/Long, I would take a proven player any day of the week over a draft pick who could potentially be a bust. According to a recent analysis, even players Mel Kiper touts as “sure things” tobackfire (statistically speaking) 2/3 of the time. Gholston is not nearly as versatile as Allen, and is more ideal for a outside rusher in a 3-4 scheme.
So in conclusion, if you see Jared Allen out DT in MPLS, buy him a shot, make sure he has his keys on him, and alert the authorities immediately after he leaves the bar.
April 24th, 2008 at 12:44 pm
Kermit,
The obvious question mark in regards to Allen, 26, are his two DUI convictions while in Kansas City, the second of which resulted in a four-game league suspension in 2007, which was subsequently reduced to two games by commissioner Roger Goodell. Much of the debate regarding the wisdom of Minnesota paying so high a price for Allen is sure to center on the question of whether he’s only one more mistake away from incurring a mandatory year-long league suspension under the terms of the league’s substance abuse policy?
One league source told SI.com on Wednesday that Allen’s two strikes in the program get wiped off the books if he stays incident free through September, at which time his most recent DUI will be two years old. He would then be out from under the threat of a year-long league suspension if he incurred another DUI after September, the source said. But that scenario could not be confirmed by an NFL spokesman Wednesday, leaving it uncertain whether Allen is a high risk for a career-interrupting suspension.
April 24th, 2008 at 1:14 pm
booyakashaw - our recent history in the draft has been outstanding. The new regime has only had 2 drafts - they are as follows
2007
adrian peterson - pro bowler
sidney rice - starter
marcus mccauley - nickle back
brian robison - situations pass rusher
aundrae allison - 4th WR and kick returner
rufus alexander - cut
tyler thigpen - tried to sneak him through waivers - unsuccessfully
chandler williams
2006
chad greenway- starter
cedric griffin - starter
ryan cook - starter
tarvaris jackson - starter
ray edwards - starter
greg blue - cut
April 24th, 2008 at 2:28 pm
Booyakashaw- Would I rather have Gholston, two third round picks and more cap room, damn right. Do I like the fact that we have allen…of course.
Oh and about T-Jack, he’ll be great. Well…good enough at least.
Hell-Eli won a superbowl.
April 24th, 2008 at 3:48 pm
Paul,
Denver, Detroit and San Francisco weren’t exactly terrifying defenses last year. At the very least, I think the Vikings have to address their QB situation by finding someone through the draft or free agency who’ll push Jackson to be better.
April 24th, 2008 at 3:53 pm
admin - you could have at least given me credit for that amazing pic
April 25th, 2008 at 5:15 pm
Kermit, unfounded comments? The forum is to get everyones opinion on the trade. I gave mine and it’s fine that you disagree but I don’t see you refuting them intelligently.
The guy is 26. He will be around for a while. I agree this move means the team thinks we can win-now but I don’t believe it will be detrimental to our future. Maybe stadium funding is a part of it, but if this move keeps the team here then wouldn’t it be worth it? From a pick value standpoint:
17th pick value: 950 points
76th pick value: 210 points
82nd pick value: 180 points
Total: 1340 points
The total value for the 3 picks the Vikings traded is roughly worth the same as the 9th pick (1350 points) So would you trade Jared Allen for the 9th pick in the draft? I personally believe he is one of the best DE’s in the game and it is worth it.
As far as the suspension, I read what clubberlang posted and responded to your concern. I will put in a link next time for you. Why do past draft busts matter? Studwell has been a part of our draft since 2002 and has had an impact on the players drafted since then. Speilman is responsible for Miami’s current situation. The past few drafts have been good, but that does not mean they are going to be excellent every year. To assume that these 3rd round picks will have the same impact as the past few (and disregard our front-office’s ENTIRE draft resume) is foolish.
Matt, I’m not arguing that Tarvaris is a franchise quarterback. I would love to have more competition for him. What do you suggest we do? Did you see the QB free agents? The list was pathetic. I don’t think Ryan, Brohm, Henne, or Flacco will be there for our 2nd round selection so who do we get and where? I believe that he improved last season and will continue to improve. Those defenses were not top-tier but they weren’t terrible. SF shut down Adrian and forced Tarvaris to win the game and he succeeded. The New York Giants had an excellent defense and he played well against them. Granted he didn’t have to do much in that game, but if he plays similar mistake-free football I believe he has the tools to win.
April 26th, 2008 at 7:11 am
Just saw a commercial here in KC for a giant draft party at Jared Allen’s bar/restaurant, which I guess is pretty appropriate if you think about it. Not sure what they’ll rename it to, but it will be sad to see the place with “Wine ‘em, dine ‘em, sixty-nine ‘em” as their slogan go.
April 26th, 2008 at 2:26 pm
[...] I am obsessed with the NFL draft. For the first time in my life I am working during the draft. I would never allow this on any draft day in which we had a first round pick. But, since we decided to trade for Jared Allen we don’t have a 1st rounder. The Vikings won’t be on the clock until I’m drunk this evening . But, lets blog for a little while. [...]